Transcript for 7/5/24: ROSWELL – THE GATHERING W/ MITCH HOROWITZ AND CHRISSY NEWTON

Weeks ago I was preparing for the Roswell gathering by brushing up on my Roswell history. It was some very welcome synchronicity that I received a file from a listener in Texas who felt this would prove the claims of David Grusch and others that we indeed recovered wreckage from alleged extraterrestrial crash sites. I detailed my research on the subject when I produced the show Projekt 1794. 

Projekt 1794, was the blueprint to build a supersonic flying saucer. This vehicle was said to be able to spin through the Earth’s stratosphere at an average top speed of about 2,600 miles per hour.

In 1956 a little under 10 years after the Roswell incident and one year after the establishment of Area 51 the documents were drawn up for an American Canadian reverse-engineered saucer. 

What attracted me to the file was I immediately saw the anagram of the numbers and figured out that 1794 was referring to 1947-- the year that an alleged flying disc crashed in Roswell, New Mexico.

I admit that this is circumstantial but the timeline of events seemed intriguing but while the Military and the Canadian company Avro scrapped their attempt at making a saucer -- I would contend that while the wreckage for Roswell may have been used for the internal framework of the machine, the shape was designed to be similar to designs that were designed by Nazis in 1942.

The real design of what crashed in Roswell looked more like the heel of a shoe-- more or less the same design that was seen by Kenneth Arnold over Mount Ranier just weeks before the Roswell Incident.

This heel-shaped craft measuring about 25 ft. long and 12 ft. wide crashed and was embedded in a cliff.

It was split open. One of its four small passengers was thrown clear. Another was partially out of the craft. Two more were inside. All were dead, their bodies intact and unburned. Quickly after the crash, it was reported that he fractured craft and bodies were loaded on a flatbed truck before dawn.

The tarpaulin-covered Army truck rolled slowly south through downtown Roswell. Unnoticed by residents, it made its way past the base gates and into a hangar, which was promptly surrounded by armed guards. Before evening, the wreckage and bodies were loaded aboard a military transport and flown first to Fort Worth, Texas, and then on to Wright Field in Ohio.

The rest of course is history --as the Military saw this as a threat to national security and so to throw the Press off the trail they officially declared that the crash at Roswell was a weather balloon.

After rumors that the dead alien bodies and the crash debris wound up in a hangar at Wright Patterson Air Force Base, there was literally a gag order on what happened in July of 1945. In fact, the gag order lasted nearly 30 years before Charles Berlitz and Stanton Friedman came forward with their investigations into the Roswell crash --and it wasn't until the early 2000s that the Military declassified many documents that indicated the building of a spacecraft that looked very similar to a flying disc allegedly sighted in the 1940s and 1950s.

The most surprising information was contained in a declassified Air Force briefing paper titled "Report On Project Silver Bug." It was prepared by the Joint Air Technical Intelligence Center at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base in 1955. 

It had two purposes.

The first was to update civilian and military intelligence experts on technical issues related to so-called flying saucers. Its second goal was to enlist the help of the FBI, CIA and intelligence units within the State Department in determining if the Soviets were pursuing similar aircraft designs.

To provide the intelligence community with technical background, the report described several ongoing U.S. saucer projects. 

Configured as classic UFOs, this craft exhibited flight specifications that were nothing short of phenomenal, even by today's standards. The largest weighed 26,000 pounds and was powered by jet engines that could lift it to an altitude of 36,900 ft.–as high as today's airliners fly–in about 1 minute 45 seconds. The operating ceiling of these amazing crafts was 80,600 ft. Their cruise speed was an astounding Mach 3.48.

The report stated that the designs could be traced to the origin of similar craft believed to be designed in Germany. 

Of course, there was no mention of reverse-engineered craft.

Whistleblower David Grusch told Congress that the first recovery of a UFO was in Magenta, Italy in 1933 and it was held by Mussolini's Italian government until 1944-1945 when Pope Pius XII tipped America off about it.

Italy was Germany's ally in World War two -- so obviously finding this technology was like finding the Holy Grail.

During the early 1940s, it appears that the Third Reich was putting considerable time, energy, and resources into the development of Saucer-shaped craft as well.

Some historians believe that the Nazis also recovered an alien spacecraft in the 1930s.

Because of specialized rotors — would be able to fly not just horizontally like most other planes but vertically and even diagonally as well.

These kinds of vehicles, if operational, held tremendous potential in the eyes of the German military. Their maneuverability made them promising weapons of aerial warfare. Their ability to move up as well as down with ease meant that they could land and lift off without requiring a mile-long runway. 

Pilots would learn how to use them to get out of tight spots, chase enemies, and of course reach places that traditional aircraft could never go.

In 1954, a memo was fired off to CIA department heads demanding intelligence on new 'saucer-like' flying machines being developed by Britain and Canada. So began the race to develop the most unlikely weapon of the Cold War.

In one of his many memos on the subject, H Marshall Chadwell, the deputy head of the agency's Office of Scientific Intelligence, declared that "something was going on that must have immediate attention". He and others in the CIA were concerned that the Soviet Union was developing a secret weapon based on the "flying discs" the Nazis were rumored to have constructed in the last months of the war.

The Air Force acknowledges the Germans were working on a flying-disc craft, but says it was inherently unstable. Declassified records suggest that these marginally performing craft were shills intended to disguise the existence of more formidable flying machines. One of the most potent of these flying discs was developed under a secret program called Project Pye Wacket. Its objective was to design a 5-ft.-dia. liquid-fueled missile launch platform to protect U.S. bombers penetrating Soviet airspace.

In the end, the military would select conventionally shaped planes and missiles. As for the flying disc that the Reich had hoped would turn the tide of battle, patent rights to a remarkably similar craft configured to carry "passengers" would be assigned to the Lockheed aircraft company. 

Recently released documents from the CIA archive are full of accounts by former German scientists of their desperate work to save the fatherland with revolutionary circular aircraft supposedly capable of enormous speeds.

Among the documents in the CIA's "X-file" archives is an interview given by a German aeronautical engineer called Georg Klein, who claimed to have worked on a Nazi flying saucer under the supervision of Luftwaffe designers, Rudolf Schriever and Richard Miethe.

Another document from the archives is a 1950 article written by a German emigre in Chile calling himself Dr Eduard Ludwig. The article, submitted to a Chilean magazine but apparently never published, was entitled: "The mystery of 'flying discs' - a contribution to its possible explanation". It recounted Dr Ludwig's wartime work at a Junkers research facility, helping develop a "one-piece metal wing" functioning as a "speedily rotating top" that was capable of vertical take-off and high speeds.

"The experiments turned out to be extremely difficult and involved many casualties," the professor observed drily, clearly rueful that the spinning top experiments had not come to fruition before the arrival of the Red Army.

He concluded: "The future will show whether the 'flying discs' are only the products of imagination or whether they are the results of a far-advanced German science which possibly, as well as the nearly finished atomic bombs, may have fallen into the hands of the Russians."

In the 1950s, "Silver Bug" was the code word for the investigation into a Saucer design created by Canada --something called Project Y.

This eventually was called Project 1794-- a design of a functional space and air vehicle.

In September 2012 the United States National Archives released the declassified records from the Aeronautical Systems Division, USAF (RG 342—Records of United States Air Force Commands, Activities, and Organizations). This included cutaways of the aircraft structure, which the National Archives noted, “bear a strong resemblance to ‘flying saucers’ in popular science fiction films made during the years these reports were created: 1956 and 1957.”

The project was eventually shut down -- but that was only one of the projects and one of many designs of saucer-like craft-- in fact, later space and air vehicles paid more of a resemblance to what had crashed at Roswell.

If you look at diagrams and schematics of the X-38 you will see that the vehicle looks more like the shape of the alien aircraft allegedly recovered at Roswell.

But that is not the only word on the subject --in fact, any Roswell researcher will have his work cut out for him or her.

According to the General Accounting Office, most of the documents about the Roswell incident have been destroyed.

In 1947, Army regulations required that air accident reports be maintained permanently none of the military services filed a report on the Roswell incident. Although some of the records concerning Roswell's activities had been destroyed, there was no information available regarding when or under what authority the records were destroyed.

Only two government records originating in 1947 have been recovered regarding the Roswell incident; in them, there is a report noting the recovery of a flying disc that was later determined by military officials to be a radar-tracking balloon.

Very convenient that this was all that was left of the reports that had been destroyed by an unknown source.

The Roswell incident, is the most well-known of all the thousands of UFO cases on record. Even people with no interest or belief in UFOs know of Roswell and the story's basic theme. 

Namely, that of a flying saucer crashing to earth back in the 1940s, and a hasty cover-up of the facts, a cover-up which persists to this day.

Roswell isn’t just any mystery – it’s potentially one of the greatest mysteries in human history. It is also one of the most covered-up stories in history -- in fact, many people are unaware that Roswell -- was completely ignored for 30 years before a real investigation happened-- it had been sealed for a long time.

The way people talk you’d think that it was all part of the culture since 1947. No-- it had been covered up for 30 years before anyone stepped forward to unveil a conspiracy. That is how well the government kept it under wraps.

After it was reported that a flying disc crashed there the press release was hastily retracted, and the wreckage was dismissed as merely a weather balloon.

From that point onwards, no one seems to have written anything about the Roswell incident until Stanton Friedman started to investigate the case in the late 1970s. The first book on the subject, by Berlitz and Moore, appeared in 1980. In other words, almost everything you’ve ever read about Roswell came into the public domain more than thirty years after the incident itself. Even that jaw-dropping press release and its subsequent retraction were never mentioned. 

It’s as if the world was turning a blind eye to the elephant in the room. To make the situation even more extraordinary, those three decades were the biggest decades in the history of ufology. “Outer space” was much bigger news than it is today. 

The 1950s were the heyday of flying saucer B-movies. The 1960s saw the race to the Moon and the Apollo landings. The 1970s heralded the dawn of the big-budget sci-fi blockbuster. UFO books abounded during these decades. They mentioned Kenneth Arnold and George Adamski and Thomas Mantell and the Maury Island Incident. 

But they never mentioned Roswell.

How can a story as big as Roswell just disappear?

It was in the public domain, after all, and it was in the public interest, yet no one ever mentioned it. There’s one obvious explanation – at least as far as military witnesses and the mainstream press are concerned: National Security. 

The Second World War had ended only two years earlier – and that was a real war against a real enemy. People could still remember wartime slogans like “Loose Talk Costs Lives”.

Roswell wasn’t just a random place on the map. It was the most security-sensitive location on the planet. The Second World War came to an end when the U.S. dropped atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki – the most destructive weapons ever deployed in history, The bombs were delivered by aircraft of the 509th Group flying from Tinian island in the Pacific. After the war, the 509th came back home... to Roswell Army Air Field in New Mexico. It’s easy enough to see why, when ordered to do so, even the most enterprising journalist might be inclined to keep his or her mouth shut.

It’s commonly assumed (not always correctly) that the earliest versions of a breaking news story are the most accurate – before the spin and disinformation have had a chance to kick in.

I believe that story was always being told behind the scenes and this is how decades of research provided the evidence necessary to reveal some of what happened-- and that the persistence is what paid off in the end.

The persistence continues and even the city of Roswell acknowledges that an event happened that cannot be explained and as long as there are no real files left in the annals of the military this becomes a cosmic cold case that needs to be solved. 

It will be hard to dig through all of the legends, mythologies, and botched timelines -- and there needs to be many more generations to keep the story alive.